Can someone work this out for me

[rudeboy500]

Hi sorry to bother you guys. I am stuck on this question hope you can help

Question

A 3KW,230V storage heater is supplied by 15m of multi-core 70 degrees PVC cable clipped direct to the wall. Protection is BS EN 60898 type C circuit breaker. Ambient temp is 30 degrees.
determine the
1 Load Current
2 CB Rating
3 cable rating
4 cable size
5 allowed voltage drop
6 Voltage Drop

Thank you in advance
Merry Christmas and happy new year

 

[Guest123]

Try using this.......

 

[ringer]

rudeboy, you are doing level 3 2330, right? If so then a calc like this should be a walk in the park for you. You will have done many such a calculation in level 2 let alone level 3. With respect mate, give it a try yourself. If you get stuck then post you calculations and we will look them over and spot where you might have gone wrong. To ask someone to so all the calcs for you will not really help you at the end of the day. So do some calcs, post each stage on here including what/where you looked things up in OSG or BRB.

 

[fuzzydunlop]

rudeboy, you are doing level 3 2330, right? If so then a calc like this should be a walk in the park for you. You will have done many such a calculation in level 2 let alone level 3. With respect mate, give it a try yourself. If you get stuck then post you calculations and we will look them over and spot where you might have gone wrong. To ask someone to so all the calcs for you will not really help you at the end of the day. So do some calcs, post each stage on here including what/where you looked things up in OSG or BRB.

Incredible isn't it and on Xmas Eve,

Sorry kids can't be with you as someone on electricians forums can't work out a basic calculation and needs an answer right now

And the mods wonder why I keep getting infracted,

Merry Christmas

 

[Amp David]

Type C as well, must want to drink so juice on start up!

Merry Christmas to all:54::carolers:

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Merry Christmas to all:54::carolers:[/QUOTE]

Type C as well, must want to drink so juice on start up! well if its a purely resistive load (storage heater) then why a c type? As both voltage and current will be "in phase" with each other....I mean its not as if its an inductive is it.....a b type should stay in shouldnt it.....


merry christmas....

 

[rudeboy500]

Thanks guys for your input.
The answers to your is i have only done this type of calculations a few times the Lecturers are really bad at teaching where I go college. I only do evening classes once a week. How much can you cover in 3hrs. I would request 1 more item from you guys has anyone got samples questions on this type of maths questions so I can work on them and understand them. I do find it hard to understand how to work out these types of questions ie where to look and which part of the question I do not have to calculate.
Thanks
Rudeboy500

 

[Engineer54]

Rudeboy500,


You can't get much clearer than the step by step approach that Lenny posted above!!

That's not to say, that others can't give you a series of sample questions for you to practice on. If i were you, i'd be telling the lecturers that your having trouble in this area, and if they could give you a little extra help. They should have in hand, a whole host of previous test paper questions of this nature, along with worked out examples to follow!!

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Rudeboy500,


You can't get much clearer than the step by step approach that Lenny posted above!!

That's not to say, that others can't give you a series of sample questions for you to practice on. If i were you, i'd be telling the lecturers that your having trouble in this area, and if they could give you a little extra help. They should have in hand, a whole host of previous test paper questions of this nature, along with worked out examples to follow!!

if the standards are poor though at this college......then i think i might tell them that i expect more for my cash......how the hell is someone supposed to "join industry"...with little or no knowledge to back em up due to slack lecturing practices?...might as well go on one of those "6 week wonder" courses for all the use it will be.....i have been lucky as the college i have chosen for myself has a top notch set up but the varying standards to be found in some these institutions is worrying to say the least..hmm.....:whatchutalkingabout

 

[mackers]

if your enrolled on a college course you should be able to use the libary the lecturer should be able to recommend the tittles relavent to this subject,thats what happened to me but that was years ago so course tuition standards may have slipped ,the thing is ,is it bad tuition or lack of understanding (no offence)if so don't be affraid to ask more questions in class or after.its in the intrests of the lecturer to get passes as fails reflect on them.also its in your interests to get the training and understanding your paying for

 

[SKY]

I have done the same question in a recent 302 exam.

 

[fuzzydunlop]

Hi sorry to bother you guys. I am stuck on this question hope you can help

Question

A 3KW,230V storage heater is supplied by 15m of multi-core 70 degrees PVC cable clipped direct to the wall. Protection is BS EN 60898 type C circuit breaker. Ambient temp is 30 degrees.
determine the
1 Load Current
2 CB Rating
3 cable rating
4 cable size
5 allowed voltage drop
6 Voltage Drop

Thank you in advance
Merry Christmas and happy new year

Can't believe I'm on here Xmas day but as its Xmas a few pointers

Break the question into its parts, first is ohms law with 3kw and 230v which gives you ( insert answer)

Next you have your ampage from part 1 so work out what size cable from the table in the OSG/Regs would be sufficient for your needs taking into account your erection method (also in the regs)

The rest should become clear, hopefully

I may have got this all wrong but I've had too much food and drink and I'm writing this on my phone

 

[Knobhead]

I’m going to be a grumpy old GIT. It’s your homework, you should do it.

BAH Humbug!

 

[Specialist]

No Tony: Not a grumpy old git mate, just straight. Gotta be honest when I first read the post it put my back up with the way the title came across: Can someone work this out for me, Not can anyone tell me where i'm going wrong or can someone give me some pointers on working this out. I don't mind helping anyone if they're stuck, we all need help & advice at times. But i'm damned if i'll do someones homework for them, when they get out on site we wont be there to hold their hands.

OP: As has already been said, if there's something you don't understand or you feel the Lecturer is not explaining properly then it's down to you to do something about it before you get in too deep. But these are pretty basic calculations.

 

[telectrix]

it's the whole education system is to blame. we did calcs like this for "0" levels, now lads in school are taught cooking, and other useless subjects, so are ill prepared for the college work.

 

[Specialist]

I know what you mean tel, but he's apparently doing the 2330 level 3 so you would have hoped this would'nt be the 1st time he'd come across this calc. You forgot Needlework by the way lol.

 

[DaveyD]

it's the whole education system is to blame. we did calcs like this for "0" levels, now lads in school are taught cooking, and other useless subjects, so are ill prepared for the college work.

lol, "When I were lad men were proper men ...."

 

[mackers]

Wouldn't say cooking useless basic needs may be I'm 40 i did cooking has been more use than learning about crop rotation in the 16 century and the new waste of time media studies etc saying that I'm getting pretty fed up of cheese on toast and Christmas log LOL

 

[telectrix]

evedrything you buy has cooking instructions anyway. don't take a genius to work out the difference between microwave from chilled and same from frozen. anything more ambitious, that's why we get married, innit?

 

[mackers]

i supose so ,but your knackered if she cant cook lol
love how these threads start off about something to do with electrics then end up about cooking! love it

 

[Specialist]

evedrything you buy has cooking instructions anyway. don't take a genius to work out the difference between microwave from chilled and same from frozen. anything more ambitious, that's why we get married, innit?

Well, there are a few other reasons tel. But that's a pretty good 1, you know if my missus reads this i'm dead meat

 

[GLENNSPARK]

well theres something else that rhymes with cooking that the fairer are useful for n all.....couldn`t live without em n all that...lol...

 

[Specialist]

well theres something else that rhymes with cooking that the fairer are useful for n all.....couldn`t live without em n all that...lol...

Well Glenn, whatever could you mean? i've only got 3 Bambinos & i don't know about things like that:drool5::tounge_smile:

 

[johnboy6083]

http://www.electriciansforums.net/e...-electrical-forum/46947-cable-selection.html#

I wrote a summary in this thread to help someone struggling with cable calcs.

 

[mackers]

I wore a summary dress lol

 

[rudeboy500]

Do all you guys take this biscuit out of people in this forum.

This course I am doing is not for fun. I am not made of money.

This course is to better myself and provide for my family so what harm is it that I ask for a bit of help.

Thank you to the guys who went out of there way to help me.
.
Thank you to the people who thought this was a joke, everyone struggles with some thing and I hope one day if you are stuck with a question i know!!!

I will be there to help you

Thanks

Rudeboy500

 

[mackers]

hi rudeboy,
if you r coming into the building trade banter and **** taking is the norm!
no fun working with people who can't take and give abit.
trouble is sometimes in this day and age it is easier to just ask the internet and let other people do the math
but the whole idea is for you to be able to go find the imformation in the regs etc to solve the problems yourself
i dont know how old you r but when i was training there was no internet (good i feel old) so you looked at the books and spoke to the lecturer,
in the faceless world of emails and texts the humour can be lost
reading the posts most have tried to help but sometimes we get side tracked
how this helps happy new year

 

[Guest112]

i see where your coming frome rudeboy500 my college was awful also i did a day release for 3 years and the lecturers there were useless bar one i should say, most of them were literally just handing out old pass papers and sometimes telling us the answers in advance, i couldnt believe it.

i have started threads in the past to no success, these old sparks had it different in their day they were taught, we were taught how to pass exams, and they have a go because your going the extra mile its silly really (i just put it down to having too much time on their hands) lennys post from page to with his calc template is great ive saved it on my comp id just go with that a bit of small calcs p/v=i and have a look at the tables in the regs mate

 

[Guest112]

read my post and you may possibly understand, colleges are different these days and the lecturers are mainly rubbish sparks who got too lazy to walk around site anymore, and i know id rather speak to sparks doing these calcs in the real world in real situations rather than simulated pretend ones, my college was awful and most people i speak to out of college say the same thing these days

@mackers

 

[rudeboy500]

Hi peterdainels,
I understand what your saying, ever since I started the electro technology course from level 2, the lecturers have some what been under par in their way of teaching.

Some Lectures cannot understand that all students coming in to this industry are not working in the electrical industry or have anything to do with the electrical industry.

Take my example I don't work in this industry I do 3 hours a week at college 6pm to 9pm trying to absorb as much as I can by the time next week comes, only 10% of what I learn't is still in my head, this is because I have work commitments, family commitments.

The lectures should ask what industry you are in ? and go from there I am in my forties plus, life at the minute is hard trying to keep a job this is why I want something to fall back on just in case the inevitable happens and I lose my job due to redundancies.

This college course in like a fast track course and City and Guilds don't make it any easier what we are being taught and what comes up on the exam paper is nearly always completely different which totally annoys me. There question are based around an everyday working life of an apprentices.
All they want to do is make money

sorry for being so bitter.

Thanks
Rudeboy500

 

[Specialist]

Rudeboy 500: I understand where your coming from, as will a lot of the other guys. But if we work out the Answer for you then how will you get any further forward ? If you ask for help then we'll give it, but we won't do your Course work for you.
Once you've finished & hopefully passed your course, what happens if you come across the same situation out on site ?.
As for the boys takeing the P well yes it happens, but you get out on site working along side a load of Hairy a**** builders or go to do maintenance in a Factory full of women working on a line then you'll get a whole lot more of it. It goes with the Territory.

 

[Guest123]

Hi peterdainels,
I understand what your saying, ever since I started the electro technology course from level 2, the lecturers have some what been under par in their way of teaching.

Some Lectures cannot understand that all students coming in to this industry are not working in the electrical industry or have anything to do with the electrical industry.

Take my example I don't work in this industry I do 3 hours a week at college 6pm to 9pm trying to absorb as much as I can by the time next week comes, only 10% of what I learn't is still in my head, this is because I have work commitments, family commitments.

The lectures should ask what industry you are in ? and go from there I am in my forties plus, life at the minute is hard trying to keep a job this is why I want something to fall back on just in case the inevitable happens and I lose my job due to redundancies.

This college course in like a fast track course and City and Guilds don't make it any easier what we are being taught and what comes up on the exam paper is nearly always completely different which totally annoys me. There question are based around an everyday working life of an apprentices.
All they want to do is make money

sorry for being so bitter.

Thanks
Rudeboy500

This is why I posted my template in post #2 to try and help give you a bit of understanding rather than just answer it all for you.

 

[fuzzydunlop]

Rudeboy don't take this the wrong way but irrespective of level of students etc.. Any course you'll undertake will only give you a basic understanding of whats being taught and it's expected of students to undertake further research/reading to build on the knowledge

To just go to college for 3hrs a week then do nothing else in-between is asking for trouble and yes I know you have other commitments but, you have to find the time to read up further, maybe you should speak with your wife about it to let you have a break from kids etc

I also did my 2330 lvl 2/3 at a fast track provider so know the commitment thats needed to learn something new without much help from lecturers and it can be tough but if you want the pieces of paper you'll receive at the end of it to be worth anything you have to put in the time and effort esp in todays market place were colleges are churning out DI's at 10 to the dozen, you have to be able to stand out

If you're struggling with theory etc, i've got the basic and advanced Tinsley books that you can have cheap?

 

[mackers]

hi rudeboy,
i can understand what your saying and i would never knock anyone for trying to better them self, but your own post say most of whats wrong about the these courses 3 hrs a week with no on site practice its gonna be hard, idont think many people could learn a trade this way.the main part of learning is the site work/experiance which u are unable to obtain due to your comittments. the college mybe rubbish but i m saying and others have said before college is only part of the training ive only just join this site this month but what im seeing is alot of questions been asked about stuff that any good experianced spark should know.u can learn theory till it comes out of your ears but theory don't pay the bills. this site should make it compulsary to list what u are to join ie electrician, apprentice,adult improver, householder then members would know how to reply.

 

[Guest112]

also everyone seems to think he wants the answer and get it the easy way but in my opinion its better to be shown how to do it before trying to do it wrong its easier to understand something if you knwo how its done if that makes any sense lol

 

[Specialist]

Hi peter: Maybe we all think he wants the answers given to him from the title, Lenny posted a link in post 2 which should have explained things & in post 12 Fuzzy laid it out quite simply.

 

[Guest112]

agreed man lennys template is good i just think it might help to see it done and learn that way just a personal preferance ill have a go at it using lennys template