Government propose register of people to carry out EICR

[Gavin John Hyde]

Just read the monthly newsletter from NICEIC, usual self congratulatory PR nonsense but something caught my eye.
The Government are proposing a register of competent persons to carry out EICR's in the private rented sector... now that would make too much sense and assume it would be along lines of AC status plus 2391/2395 etc etc... or equivalent..
NICEIC/Elecsa are asking for feedback on the ideas but as soon as I read that I see it purely as the schemes seeing £ signs and a way to further entrench the view among some that only NICEIC people are electricians...
Government policy change in England may create a new Register of Competent Persons to undertake electrical safety checks in the private rented sector.
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We have put together a short survey to understand your views on it.

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

I have looked and found the consultation
https://assets.publishing.service.g...100/Consultation_on_PRS_Electrical_Safety.pdf
Essentially it will if implemented be a separate register to the current part p/cps ones. and only those on the new register will be allowed to do EICR's on rented properties. I see the goodside being it will stop a lot of cowboys who dont have a clue in their tracks. it wont stop them all as a few with 2391 certificates are plums, you cna pass a course but a good eicr takes experience and discretion.
downside- it will mean another yearly fee... no doubt the NICEIC are already rubbing there hands together at the prospect of adding extra fees to the AC annual cost to boost the directors bonus pot.

 

[Toneyz]

downside- it will mean another yearly fee.

I was waiting for that one!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Andy78]

Approved contractors are already backed by the NICEIC for periodic inspections, same as NAPIT full scope and STROMA full scope.

They already assess the competence of candidates for this purpose.

If any new register is anything like the CPS schemes then it will be a joke, the seeds of which are already sewn with now all recognised T&I quals being open book watered down exams.

 

[Christopher Bernard]

I was asked by Napit to give my feedback on this a while ago, not sure what will come of it though.

 

[AJshep]

I'm just in the process of joining NAPIT ( awaiting my assessment) anyway when speaking to the polite young lady over the phone, she said something that caught my attention,
She said, "Your be inroled as full scope but because you have have got your 2391 you will also be listed by NAPIT as approved to do EICR. It's quite a good because people searching for a contractor will see you listed".

It was something I was going to ask the assesor on my assessment as I was on the mobile in the rain at the time, and I took it as marketing mojo.

Maybe NAPIT have already started this ?

 

[Octopus]

There is absolutely no point in another scheme unless such schemes police standards, act on reports on poor work, do random checks and kick people out.....

 

[SparkyChick]

I'm just in the process of joining NAPIT ( awaiting my assessment) anyway when speaking to the polite young lady over the phone, she said something that caught my attention,
She said, "Your be inroled as full scope but because you have have got your 2391 you will also be listed by NAPIT as approved to do EICR. It's quite a good because people searching for a contractor will see you listed".

It was something I was going to ask the assesor on my assessment as I was on the mobile in the rain at the time, and I took it as marketing mojo.

Maybe NAPIT have already started this ?

It's been like this for NAPIT since at least 2016. I had to provide proof of my T&I quals before I would be listed for EICRs.

 

[mhar]

I am registered with Stroma for full scope domestic, EICRs, and 3rd party notification because of 2391.
Problem is that only they and I know this!!! Even if I was to advertise the fact it would mean sweet fa to the majority of the public, and therein lies the problem.
As murdoch says, proper enforcement of standards is required, what part P registration was meant to be about

 

[AJshep]

Yeah it does annoy me..
I spent the last 20 years working as an Electrican 5 of those learning and found an apprenticeship, I'm eligable for a Approved Gold Card JIB standard ( just waiting to get it endorsed by NAPIT) but as far as the general public are concerned I'm not qualified because I don't have my part P.

There words, not mine !

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

Well i think the new register will sit very much seperate and landlords will have to chose from its lists. Its only going to apply eicr regulation to private rentals. At the sametime this is coming out of grenfill tower.... if they enforce the new one then it can work well. But its down to enforcement... if a person does a eicr and subsequently sonething goes amiss then there needs to be meaningful consequences

 

[suffolkspark]

Id be all for all of this part p crap if it was actually engorced... If they enforce this like in scotland with eicrs on rentals then id be for it too.... Saying that... Would there be enough electricians? Theres alot of private rentals in england... Most have probably never seen an electrician through the door!

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

Supply a

Id be all for all of this part p crap if it was actually engorced... If they enforce this like in scotland with eicrs on rentals then id be for it too.... Saying that... Would there be enough electricians? Theres alot of private rentals in england... Most have probably never seen an electrician through the door!

Supply and demand! if every rental has to have a EICR possibly every year if a change of tenants and there is only x number of approved people to do them then surely the price will be a true reflection of the skill and experience involved instead of wannabes doing a eicr for 70 quid beer money.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I envisage another surge in people taking the 2391 and a load of new members to forums asking questions on how to deal with this, that and the other.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

If the Government introduce legislation which requires rented property to be inspected every year or so, there will be a lot of people jumping at the chance to earn some easy money.
Any legislation will probably be watered down so that a Visual will be all that is required.
They’ll still want the inspectors to hold the 2391, so at least they should know enough to know a Visual is as much use as a chocolate fireguard.

 

[Dillb]

I envisage another surge in people taking the 2391 and a load of new members to forums asking questions on how to deal with this, that and the other.

Probably be best that it has its own sub section within the DIY section if it does happen?

 

[Dillb]

I am registered with Stroma for full scope domestic, EICRs, and 3rd party notification because of 2391.
Problem is that only they and I know this!!! Even if I was to advertise the fact it would mean sweet fa to the majority of the public, and therein lies the problem.
As murdoch says, proper enforcement of standards is required, what part P registration was meant to be about

Some people really are easyily parted from their money, I carry out EICRs and not registered with any scam, what do they offer you that is of benefit too yourself?

 

[Bellendian]

Personally I think the regs need to be re written on this, now that there tend to be more short term tenancies. Clearly there is no value in doing a full EICR every 6 months, which a landlord could be required to do, if the 'change of tenancy' term is strictly adhered too.
I'd see more value in putting the onus on the landlord to keep proper records for say 6 years, coupled with a full EICR mandatory every 5 years, and a mandatory visual every year to see if anything has been damaged or altered since the previous EICR. At least this way the inspector will have records available and therefore number of points, number and type of circuits can be cross checked to verify if people have been bodging!

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

maybe it will go down the energy performance certificate route, it wont be long before somebody suggests a eicr as part of the sellers pack! will make for an interesting life when buying a house as you could use it to haggle down... the sellers would then be legally obliged to hand it over warts and all!

 

[Octopus]

Some people really are easyily parted from their money, I carry out EICRs and not registered with any scam, what do they offer you that is of benefit too yourself?

There is no requirement for any qualifications to do EICR's.... Just competence

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

There is no requirement for any qualifications to do EICR's.... Just competence

well that looks like its about to change as to be deemed competent you will have to have to relevant certificate.... can see niceic doing there own equivalent qualifications to make it easy to get in and make more money....

 

[Octopus]

So who is going to make this decision?

Me thinks the DCLG has its hands full at the moment.

And nobody will take this seriously..... It's not as if part P has been a resounding success and standards have improved ....

 

[Andy78]

Some people really are easyily parted from their money, I carry out EICRs and not registered with any scam, what do they offer you that is of benefit too yourself?

Stroma don't charge any more for this than the basic membership.

 

[Dillb]

Stroma don't charge any more for this than the basic membership.

Fair enough, so it’s jist more sales jargon to make people think there getting more for their money.

 

[Andy78]

Fair enough, so it’s jist more sales jargon to make people think there getting more for their money.

Not really that either, it wasn't pushed at all with me in sales way. Merely asked which parts I wanted to register for at my initial assessment.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

There’s no real legal definition of competent.
The closest I can find, is in Regulation 16 of EAWR 1989.
“No person shall be engaged in any work activity where technical knowledge or experience is necessary to prevent danger or, where appropriate, injury, unless he possesses such knowledge or experience, or is under such degree of supervision as may be appropriate having regard to the nature of the work.”

 

[sparksfly]

I agree with the OP it looks like another income opportunity for sure. Not against tightening up the EICR but ...Who will police all this?
The letting agents will still want their maintenance cover done cheap as chips to make more profit.
Once deemed safe, with a SATISFACTORY EICR certificate (at a price/package they deem reasonable for the Landlords)......in pops "Trotters Independent Traders" replacing plastic fittings & accessories with metal, an extra socket or "while you're there mate" put up a chandelier .......life's now safer isn't it !!!

lets tick those boxes, tick those boxes, more boxes please more yummy boxes.

BTW no offence to anyone named Trotter and the above directs no harm to BS7671 in anyway shape or form. However, -ve issues could be raised towards future releases if any more tick boxes appear for "Model forms for certification and reporting" Appendix

 

[Octopus]

I agree with the OP it looks like another income opportunity for sure. Not against tightening up the EICR but ...Who will police all this?

Hum ............ based on the fact that Part P isn't policed, Gas Safe isn't policed ................... my crystal ball says nobody will.

 

[Octopus]

We stayed in some friends rental property in Scotland last week.

This is the CU ...............

Not sure how it passed its last inspection 5 years ago and they are not aware of the "recent" changes either....

 

[Pete999]

Hum ............ based on the fact that Part P isn't policed, Gas Safe isn't policed ................... my crystal ball says nobody will.

Never a truer word spoken, Panic management at it's best, well said Murdoch

 

[Octopus]

Never a truer word spoken

I was doing an EICR today and the Landlord was there .... he was telling me that Woking has a real problem with rogue landlords from a "certain community" .................... wonder who's going to sort them out to?

 

[sparksfly]

We stayed in some friends rental property in Scotland last week.

This is the CU ...............


View attachment 41758

Not sure how it passed its last inspection 5 years ago and they are not aware of the "recent" changes either....

its fine...its fine....just make a box out of plasterboard a lick of Hammerite and cover it, nothing wrong with the old equipment...its just bad maintenance is the issue.

 

[sparksfly]

no smoke without fire
He was only grilling cheese on toast...smoked of course !