Replacing a 13A plug fuse with solid brass

[nicebutdim]

The thread is about two points:


2) Manufacturers not honouring warrantees because a moulded plug is cut off to hard wire the appliance or fit a round pin fuseless 15A plug.

Which manufacturers are you referring to and on what basis have they invalidated warranties?

If the manufacturer stipulates that an appliance must be fused, then this requirement is met as you have an FCU in place. It's possible that they might refuse to honour any warranty claim on their fitted flex, but they'd be hard pressed to invalidate an appliance warranty on this basis.

Not sure your thinking this through as the very suggestion is indefensible. If I buy a new car and subsequently modify the suspension, it is quite possible that any claim for failure of suspension components bushes/joints etc will be refused, but warranty of engine/transmission/electrical components will remain intact. In order for a manufacturer to refuse to honour a warranty claim, they must demonstrate a valid reason for doing so and removal of an appliance plug certainly doesn't meet that criteria.

 

[westward10]

Many Sparks do all sorts not to invalidate the warrantee. I am sure in court the makers would lose of an applaince conform to current regs and it is electrically safe and sound. But that is no comfort when the maker is being awkward. Electricians do not want the hassle factor, even if they know they are right, It loses them time and money.

Again what Regs are you referring to. Are you ever going to confirm this.

 

[nicebutdim]

Again what Regs are you referring to. Are you ever going to confirm this.

You know that's never going to be answered in any meaningful way.

 

[nicebutdim]

One last point...

I'd much rather deal with the possibility of arguing over a cut off plug, than explain why an appliance engineer found a glorified bolt where the fuse ought to be.

 

[telectrix]

The thread is about two points:

1) Where to buy solid links for 13A plugs?
2) Manufacturers not honouring warrantees because a moulded plug is cut off to hard wire the appliance or fit a round pin fuseless 15A plug.

To boldly Troll where no Troll has gone before.

 

[Lucien Nunes]

There's ordinary trolling and there's superior-quality trolling that asks relevant and provocative questions which seems to be one of the OP's gambits. In this case even after 85 posts I am not convinced the correct answer has been stated explicitly and while acknowledging the trollish nature of the posting this suggests that it is not actually a 'silly question.'

My understanding is this: To supply or fit a plug or modify the installation of a plug on a domestic appliance in a professional capacity, is to place such a plug or modification on the market. It is therefore required to comply with the 'Plugs and Sockets etc. (Safety) Regulations 1994.' Part I requires that any plug designed to engage in a socket-outlet made to the dimensions of BS1363:1984 must incorporate a fuse-link to BS 1362. Since the solid link does not comply with BS1362, even if the plug complies with BS1363 and the completed installation as a whole provides no lesser degree of safety than it would with a BS1362 fuse-link fitted, the act of supplying the modified plug is in contravention of the P&S(S)R which is a product safety regulation not under the scope of BS7671 and cannot be exempted within a BS7671 departure.

Please do not be distracted by the option in section 6 paragraph (2) '...shall contain or be accompanied by a fuse link...' which appears to condone taping an approved fuse-link to the outside of the plug fitted with a solid link. I do not think that is a valid interpretation.

The Plugs and Sockets etc. (Safety) Regulations 1994

These Regulations re–enact with modifications the provisions of the Plugs and Sockets etc. (Safety) Regulations 1987 (S.I. 1987/603) and make provision for the first time for certain requirements to be satisfied in relation to appliances.

www.legislation.gov.uk

 

[ChipFanDave]

There's ordinary trolling and there's superior-quality trolling that asks relevant and provocative questions which seems to be one of the OP's gambits. In this case even after 85 posts I am not convinced the correct answer has been stated explicitly and while acknowledging the trollish nature of the posting this suggests that it is not actually a 'silly question.'

My understanding is this: To supply or fit a plug or modify the installation of a plug on a domestic appliance in a professional capacity, is to place such a plug or modification on the market. It is therefore required to comply with the 'Plugs and Sockets etc. (Safety) Regulations 1994.' Part I requires that any plug designed to engage in a socket-outlet made to the dimensions of BS1363:1984 must incorporate a fuse-link to BS 1362. Since the solid link does not comply with BS1362, even if the plug complies with BS1363 and the completed installation as a whole provides no lesser degree of safety than it would with a BS1362 fuse-link fitted, the act of supplying the modified plug is in contravention of the P&S(S)R which is a product safety regulation not under the scope of BS7671 and cannot be exempted within a BS7671 departure.

Please do not be distracted by the option in section 6 paragraph (2) '...shall contain or be accompanied by a fuse link...' which appears to condone taping an approved fuse-link to the outside of the plug fitted with a solid link. I do not think that is a valid interpretation.

The Plugs and Sockets etc. (Safety) Regulations 1994

These Regulations re–enact with modifications the provisions of the Plugs and Sockets etc. (Safety) Regulations 1987 (S.I. 1987/603) and make provision for the first time for certain requirements to be satisfied in relation to appliances.

www.legislation.gov.uk

Just beat me to it !!!

 

[telectrix]

brass has some scrap value. use a steel roofing bolt with the head cut off.

 

[Dave OCD]

View attachment 90958

Ah ! You've been very creative and borrowed a 2nd neutral pin from another plug ! ?

 

[DPG]

Ah ! You've been very creative and borrowed a 2nd neutral pin from another plug ! ?

He's obviously a pro.

 

[IAmSparkytus!]

Why not disconnect the flex with moulded plug from the appliance, fit a new flex and connect into a flex outlet fed from your fused spur and then if there's ever a problem with the appliance, put the original flex back on!

Fuse behind appliance "problem" - Avoided!
Manufacturers warranty problem - Avoided!

 

[Darkwood]

The whole thread seems to be a bit of a baiting attempt here, @John-SJW, exactly what is your electrical knowledge, qualifications etc as your profile is missing such info.
Plug fuses are rarely in place for overload but are covering short circuit compliance to the flexes often used, the idea of replacing a fuse with solid metal jumpers shows a complete lack of understanding on the matter.
We can discuss this in thread or PM me if you want, I await your response.

 

[freddo]

He's obviously a pro.

But what do I do with all these?

 

[Lucien Nunes]

Recording studios sometimes run gear from CT-E supplies to minimise hum pickup. Muscle-in on Walsall's act and sell them some DP-fused plugs.

 

[7029 dave]

90 odd posts on nonsense YAWN

 

[pirate]

If you can't find solid copper links, why not cut down a section of busbar??

Oh, wait...

 

[UNG]

I say some manufacturers try to side step warrantee claims by nick picking, and one is that the moulded plug may be not removed. It may be replaced by a sound and safe plug to regs, but they try and fob you off. It may be that the appliance is hard wired in, they will still try and fob you off so they will not pay.

Had a conversation with an appliance engineer a good few years ago on this subject and his response was there is no problem cutting a moulded plug off and replacing it with a plug there is also no problem hard wiring into a flex outlet plate but if a warranty repair is needed then it will have to be disconnected and a plug fitted before the engineer arrives as the only safe isolation procedure they are taught is to remove the plug from the socket outlet

 

[littlespark]

Been waiting a few days, thought we might have got the century, but here’s my thoughts.

Leave the moulded plug on the appliance, 13A fuse.
Switch fuse above counter with less than 13A fuse… 10 or 5 even.

With a bit of luck, the lesser fuse blows first.

Otherwise…. A bit of planning beforehand negates this completely. Socket for appliance in accessible space in adjacent cabinet.

 

[John-SJW]

Been waiting a few days, thought we might have got the century, but here’s my thoughts.

Leave the moulded plug on the appliance, 13A fuse.
Switch fuse above counter with less than 13A fuse… 10 or 5 even.

With a bit of luck, the lesser fuse blows first.

Otherwise…. A bit of planning beforehand negates this completely. Socket for appliance in accessible space in adjacent cabinet.

In a hidden position, a 15A round pin fuseless plug and socket can be fitted on the appliance, with an FCU above. Then only one fuse to blow.

 

[DPG]

In a hidden position, a 15A round pin fuseless plug and socket can be fitted on the appliance, with an an FCU above. Then only one fuse to blow.

I really don't see why you keep pushing this. How many times do your kitchen appliances blow fuses for no reason. If they do it often then I suggest there is something wrong. And if there's something wrong then the appliance is coming out anyway.

And what about using a 20A switch instead of FCU?

Putting a 15A plug on appliances is not a good solution to your 'problem'.