Ground floor lighting trips out mcb

[Biggy]

Hi everyone,

My first post but straight in with a couple of issues.

I'll start with a 6amp MCB that keeps tripping out relating to ground floor lights.
For your info:

There is 10 x 3w led recessed lights in Kitchen, 8 x 3w led recessed lights ,plus a main central Led light (approx 100watt equivalent ) in the room next to the kitchen and then the same amount of lights and Main central light in the Back room. I would say the combined wattage including two outside lights (40watt each) will be around 480w so let's call it 500watt on the ground floor.

From my understanding a 60w bulb draws around 0.5amp so in effect 30 of the 60w bulbs (around 1800watt combined ) would require a 15amp breaker which would be comfortable, so based on this theory is the 6amp MCB actually overload on 500watts on Ground floor and this tripping the breaker .

The breaker does not trip immediately as can take 5-10mins sometimes longer, and in some instances it has tripped even when ground floor lights have been OFF.

The joist spaces have all been insulated with rockwool if this makes any difference as I want to eliminate any possibility before I start questioning my electrician who advises that maybe I should fit a 15amp breaker in as he feels 6amp is less power for 30 odd lights .

Can anyone shed LIGHT on this

I'll come to the second issue after I can get a solution to this.

Sorry for the lengthy explanation but I know there's nothing more frustrating than not arming knowledgeable people will full info and expecting solutions. Hope I've not missed anything out.

Hope to get a few responses and guidance as I have basic understanding of electrics.

Thanks

 

[Biggy]

Should I upload the EIC cert with all readings for you guys to look at , will that help ?

 

[Strima]

Should I upload the EIC cert with all readings for you guys to look at , will that help ?

That would help, please scrub out/cover any personal information.

 

[Biggy]

Here's the cert docs

View attachment IMG_20181231_165623.jpg

View attachment IMG_20181231_165608.jpg

 

[Markyd]

The man can't even spell cellar

 

[DC-backfrom the past]

ok, an insulation test could come back as a pass.
I had similar recently with a light circuit, the only time it tripped was during the extremely cold weather, the cable contracted and it got tight around the metal on the joists (in the loft). The rest of the time the cable didn't touch the metal and passed the insulation test.

We know electricity is a force of its own at times and sometimes can even seem magical.

good luck finding the fault hope its sorted soon

 

[Octopus]

Here's the cert docs

View attachment 46815

View attachment 46816

Ok .......... doesn't inspire confidence in the arrangement of the circuits , nor the spelling nor the missing sheets.

Without wishing to wind up the OP ............... could you please outline the scope of work done by this sparky ................. before the issues became evident...

This may help

 

[Octopus]

A water leak would be identified with the IR test if there was moisture between cores the IR test would indicate this

Not necessarily ............ a "drip" onto a light fitting or into a JB could be "cleared" by the heat generated by the L-N or L-E fault ....

Seen this before .......

 

[Octopus]

Little update, I got family member who knows a little on electrics to come give a view on it whilst I'm waiting and he has tried the following:

Next thing he did was swop upstairs 6amp breaker to downstairs and see if upstairs trips to eliminate faulty breaker. The lights this time stayed on for 1hr 40 mins before I decided to switch them off and go home.
Returned this morning to find the trip had switched for ground floor, so this has definitely eliminated a faulty breaker which isn't the case.

He will check all switches for loose wiring today and maybe disconnect all led spotlights and just leave the two main central lights in each room wired up and then see if they trip, as he thinks if they don't trip then the problem may well be with the cheap transformers and may have to replace all transformers with maybe 5watt capacity to sufficiently supply the 3w led lights .

Only baffling thing is they can still trip whilst lights are off so somebody here mentioned it rules out the drivers .

As for the installer whether he is NIC approved , the answer is I am not sure but is there a way to check online or somewhere , I know the tester is as he provided the certificate .

I thought you were referring to YOUR home?

 

[oracle]

No, you could see it was in jest. It is other members picking on other members weaknesses.

Always in jest, never serious!

 

[Biggy]

It is my home. I will move into this one from my current one as have had extension work done to make it bigger for us all.
The sparky has done all the rewire from light, sockets , outside sockets ,outside lights, extractor fans, smoke alarm, heat alarm to each floor.

Wiring fed to system boiler tank , etc .

Anyway, I'm stressed now so want to get back to you guys towards end of the week whilst I try and get more progress so will reply again after New Year.

Thanks and wish you all well.

 

[Octopus]

It is my home. I will move into this one from my current one as have had extension work done to make it bigger for us all.
The sparky has done all the rewire from light, sockets , outside sockets ,outside lights, extractor fans, smoke alarm, heat alarm to each floor.

Wiring fed to system boiler tank , etc .

Anyway, I'm stressed now so want to get back to you guys towards end of the week whilst I try and get more progress so will reply again after New Year.

Thanks and wish you all well.

Ok ............. so this isn't an existing installation, its a complete rewire where a "sparky" has done the installation and a "tester" has done the testing. This for a start doesn't inspire confidence.

You need to stand firm and communicate with these individuals in writing ................. if they choose not to respond , I recommend you with hold any payments due AND also consider reporting them to local trading standards ..........

If may be prudent to ask around for another spark ......... sounds like you may need one and make sure that they are able to test and certificate - they can't issue a Part P certificate nor an EIC but they should be able to do some comparison readings with that EIC you have.

Out of interest have either of these individuals mentioned Part P?

Please keep us updated.

 

[Toneyz]

I thought you were referring to YOUR home?

I think this is a house he is going to move into. Good thinking regarding the water leak could be one of the possibilities. Happy New Year to you all.

 

[Midwest]

Happy Ne Year You filthy Animals

 

[Biggy]

Hi All,

Another update this side of the year now, after unscrewing a couple switches and outside lights which seemed to be fine, we just moved a little wiring within the switches to avoid them all touching and overlapping each other too much and the same with the outside lights ( this prob makes no difference anyway bit just to be sure ) . Also unclipped and left to hang the spotlights in the main living room only and its been 5-6 days and not tripped the breaker.

I did use lights whilst working there maybe an hour or two and they seem fine for now.

It now could be possible that the living room ceiling may have been damp as the plaster boarders mentioned they had a little leak in the bottom of the mixing bucket which caused water from the floor above to seep through the living room ceiling and in between this there was rockwool insulation.

This will need to be checked when I reach in and see if I can feel whether its damp, so in meantime the spotlights are dangling down and it seems to have stopped the tripping.

I've not had much time over the Xmas and new year period to get much done and I will now check with EIC if the tester was registered as I believe the certificate number on the paperwork given should be logged online at some point.

I will refit the spots some time this week and check the trip switch again.

 

[Biggy]

Sorry everyone I've not had time to get anything done , I've had a terrible 2018 and thought 2019 will give me a new start only to find my wife has a thyroid cancerous lump in her throat and is going in for a op first thing Monday morning, news just came yesterday and she is being fast tracked .

I won't be around for a few weeks I suppose until we can get over this hurdle and everything is on hold now as nothing's more important to me than her and my 5 children.

Please pray it all goes well for her

Thanks to you all for your input. See you soon I hope.

 

[DPG]

All the best Biggy. I'm sure everyone on the forum wishes your wife well.

I'm sure you will be back on here soon.