swimming pool lighting

[Deleted member 9648]

Have a problem with a local school pool,the current lighting is standard corrosive proof 6ft flu's located in zone 1...these are knackered and require replacement.Problem is that they cant be located in zone 2 for practical reasons. 702.55.4 states that 230v luminaires can be located in zone 1 as long as they 'have an enclosure providing class II or equivalent insulation'. Now the present lights are clearly class I as they require an earth....but as they have totally enclosed IP insulated enclosures does that count as a 'Class II enclosure'?. A further issue is that having checked with manufacturers standard corrosive proof flu's are not designed for a chlorine loaded atmosphere,and hence not recommended in swimming pools.
My question is does anyone know of a class II IP rated 6ft flu designed for swimming pools so that the job can be a straight swap...otherwise we are struggling to come up with an alternative that is practical.

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Jesus Wirepuller hit me with an easier one!!!!!

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Jesus Wirepuller hit me with an easier one!!!!!

Anyone know how to wire a plug?

 

[Richard Burns]

After post 3, I will have to go back to post one!:ack2:

I would say that since it can be "equivalent insulation" so long as the external surfaces of the luminaire do not require earthing, i.e the fully enclosed PC type ones with the external mounting. and the body of the fitting is equivalent to reinforced insulation (which it would be) then it should be OK to use in zone 1 of a swimming pool.

However finding the fitting that is suitable for a chlorine laden atmosphere is more difficult.
Generally the Chlorine is presented as sodium hypochlorite (bleach) which is an alkaline material which is adverse on aluminium.
The Sodium hypochlorite gives rise to chloramines which are irritant and mildly alkaline but not really corrosive. Some Chlorine is also given off as sodium hypochlorite is stored which is much more corrosive, but overall I would not expect a serious effect on plastics from these materials.
However I seem to remember that most fittings now state they are not suitable for corrosive atmospheres (which is what one would assume they were actually designed for!).

Perhaps the effects on seals and grommets may be more of the problem?
Using silicone seals and grommets seals may help if you can find any fittings that do that.
Alternatively looking up hazardous atmosphere lighting may bring up some suitable fittings.

 

[sparks1234]

Batten holders no good then….LOL

 

[Engineer54]

If the swimming pool room is wall vented either naturally or by extraction fans i really can't see much of a problem. Chlorine levels in a swimming pool environment aren't exactly saturated to anywhere near the level you would find in say an industrial environment.

I have a standard all plastic fitting in my pools plant room, no obvious signs of any deterioration in the 15 years of service so far...

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Thanks chaps......the present lights do not seem to have suffered any chemical damage,and personally I think a like for like replacement would be fine,but we have to take into consideration manufactures instructions and I'm still not sure on the 'class ii enclosure' bit,seems a bit of a grey area,which is of course a rare thing in 7671!
Still a bit stumped as the school is expecting us to come up with an alternative scheme.

 

[Clive P]

Hi,

Just had a look at Thorn lighting-Sports lighting, worth a read. Looks like Acrylic diffusers are acceptable.

Regards.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Hi,

Just had a look at Thorn lighting-Sports lighting, worth a read. Looks like Acrylic diffusers are acceptable.

Regards.

Thanks,yes...have seen that,still gives me a class II issue though.

 

[i=p/u]

As above just cause cpc is in there doesn't mean it's a class1 fitting. All plastic is class11.

Cpc is there cause we have to run them with line conductors.. No issue in my eyes.

 

[Welchyboy1]

As above just cause cpc is in there doesn't mean it's a class1 fitting. All plastic is class11.

Cpc is there cause we have to run them with line conductors.. No issue in my eyes.

with enclosed fluorescents the internal control gear and lamp holding tray is class 1 but the fitting is class 2

im sure you can get corrosion resistant enclosed class2 fluros

 

[MDJ]

You need a moisture/vapour proof fitting which most school kitchens have fella, the type with the plastic clips down both sides and a rubber seal between the shade and the base, the tray is metal but the whole light actually class 2, a 6ft twin from a wholesaler would be around £60-70+ VAT I would think. I haven't got my office pc on today with my lighting catalogues in the bookmark folder otherwise I would actually show you links to the type of light I am talking about, off the shelf or next day delivery I'm sure pal.

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

Wired a swimming pool in a school a few years ago, then left the company before we put the fittings in. I can tell you that 1.5 HR singles in stainless 2x2 trunking at a height of 5.6 metres above the pool is ok, although this... Is friggin useless to you.

i am sure a standard vapour proof fitting only has a earth terminal to protect the metal tray holding the switch gear and as said before, the fitting is class 2 as it is a high IP than X4 and has no conductive parts outside of the fitting (unless you don't use the brackets provided and then drill and screw it.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

You need a moisture/vapour proof fitting which most school kitchens have fella, the type with the plastic clips down both sides and a rubber seal between the shade and the base, the tray is metal but the whole light actually class 2, a 6ft twin from a wholesaler would be around £60-70+ VAT I would think. I haven't got my office pc on today with my lighting catalogues in the bookmark folder otherwise I would actually show you links to the type of light I am talking about, off the shelf or next day delivery I'm sure pal.

with enclosed fluorescents the internal control gear and lamp holding tray is class 1 but the fitting is class 2

im sure you can get corrosion resistant enclosed class2 fluros

Wired a swimming pool in a school a few years ago, then left the company before we put the fittings in. I can tell you that 1.5 HR singles in stainless 2x2 trunking at a height of 5.6 metres above the pool is ok, although this... Is friggin useless to you.

i am sure a standard vapour proof fitting only has a earth terminal to protect the metal tray holding the switch gear and as said before, the fitting is class 2 as it is a high IP than X4 and has no conductive parts outside of the fitting (unless you don't use the brackets provided and then drill and screw it.

These are the standard 'corrosive proof' fittings which any wholesaler stocks though,and what is presently installed.Snag is though these are not suitable for swimming pools according to the manufacturers,as the chlorine affect the enclosure.

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

I was just having a waffle on really sorry. I have tried googling it with no joy none are chlorine proof, surely the wholesales must know where to get them!

 

[MDJ]

These are the standard 'corrosive proof' fittings which any wholesaler stocks though,and what is presently installed.Snag is though these are not suitable for swimming pools according to the manufacturers,as the chlorine affect the enclosure.

You Sure?

 

[Engineer54]

I was just having a waffle on really sorry. I have tried googling it with no joy none are chlorine proof, surely the wholesales must know where to get them!

As i've stated above chlorine saturation in an indoor swimming pools environment is going to be very low, as will be the concentration of chlorine in the pool water. I can't remember installing any so-called special pool room lighting fittings in any of the indoor pools that have been involved in, apart from being totally enclosed plastic fittings. So the type of plastic fittings that are being suggested here should more than adequate/fit for purpose. It should be noticed that wirepuller has stated himself, that no visual signs of degradation is evident to the existing enclosed plastic fittings..

Manufactures from my experience can be fickle people to deal with, tending to always aire on the safe side when talking about anything outside of the norm... If this school swimming pool has a well vented through flow system, (either natural or forced air flow) then i really can't see any problem whatsoever. It would be a different matter if we were talking of manufacturing process where concentrations of chlorine can be high....